Washington Post: Bankruptcy Could Offer GM More Flexibility
11-29-2008, 12:14 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: 11-14-2007
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 1,240
Washington Post: Bankruptcy Could Offer GM More Flexibility
11-29-2008, 01:15 PM
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: 07-05-2008
Location: Akron Ohio
Posts: 5,464
IF it were only that easy.
They fail to mention the vendors that will not sell to you any longer because you stiffed them the last time.
Also how do you convince buyers of Toyota's and Hondas to come over to buy your cars in the first place let alone from a company in bankruptcy.
To the many who want the big three to file they would have already if it was all that easy and ensured a positive future.
Bankruptcy in the auto industry is not like it is in many other industries.
I do not understand how the Gov just hands over billions to Citi Corp and never ask one question and then they grill the Big three over thier needs.
The CEO of Citi Corp made $260 Mill last year and has only been there one year. If you look at the CEO's of the big three I don't think combined they made much over $15 Mil.
Makes one have strong feelings people like Chris Dodd and Barney Frank are just covering their A$$'s by bailing out the banks.
It is time we hold the banks to the same standards as the auto industry.
They fail to mention the vendors that will not sell to you any longer because you stiffed them the last time.
Also how do you convince buyers of Toyota's and Hondas to come over to buy your cars in the first place let alone from a company in bankruptcy.
To the many who want the big three to file they would have already if it was all that easy and ensured a positive future.
Bankruptcy in the auto industry is not like it is in many other industries.
I do not understand how the Gov just hands over billions to Citi Corp and never ask one question and then they grill the Big three over thier needs.
The CEO of Citi Corp made $260 Mill last year and has only been there one year. If you look at the CEO's of the big three I don't think combined they made much over $15 Mil.
Makes one have strong feelings people like Chris Dodd and Barney Frank are just covering their A$$'s by bailing out the banks.
It is time we hold the banks to the same standards as the auto industry.
11-29-2008, 01:25 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: 02-10-2007
Location: LBC Ohio
Posts: 2,727
IF it were only that easy.
They fail to mention the vendors that will not sell to you any longer because you stiffed them the last time.
Also how do you convince buyers of Toyota's and Hondas to come over to buy your cars in the first place let alone from a company in bankruptcy.
To the many who want the big three to file they would have already if it was all that easy and ensured a positive future.
Bankruptcy in the auto industry is not like it is in many other industries.
I do not understand how the Gov just hands over billions to Citi Corp and never ask one question and then they grill the Big three over thier needs.
The CEO of Citi Corp made $260 Mill last year and has only been there one year. If you look at the CEO's of the big three I don't think combined they made much over $15 Mil.
Makes one have strong feelings people like Chris Dodd and Barney Frank are just covering their A$$'s by bailing out the banks.
It is time we hold the banks to the same standards as the auto industry.
They fail to mention the vendors that will not sell to you any longer because you stiffed them the last time.
Also how do you convince buyers of Toyota's and Hondas to come over to buy your cars in the first place let alone from a company in bankruptcy.
To the many who want the big three to file they would have already if it was all that easy and ensured a positive future.
Bankruptcy in the auto industry is not like it is in many other industries.
I do not understand how the Gov just hands over billions to Citi Corp and never ask one question and then they grill the Big three over thier needs.
The CEO of Citi Corp made $260 Mill last year and has only been there one year. If you look at the CEO's of the big three I don't think combined they made much over $15 Mil.
Makes one have strong feelings people like Chris Dodd and Barney Frank are just covering their A$$'s by bailing out the banks.
It is time we hold the banks to the same standards as the auto industry.
11-29-2008, 02:07 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: 03-08-2008
Location: United States of Texas
Posts: 505
If any of the Big Thre go under so does America
If any of the Big Three go under now America would immediatly go into a full depression. Now I do not ike the idea of giving Government money to any business it is absolutly critical to our economy that they survive.
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
11-29-2008, 02:08 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: 02-10-2007
Location: LBC Ohio
Posts: 2,727
If any of the Big Three go under now America would immediatly go into a full depression. Now I do not ike the idea of giving Government money to any business it is absolutly critical to our economy that they survive.
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
11-29-2008, 06:23 PM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: 05-22-2008
Location: G'town, MD
Posts: 391
Oddly enough, I believe that if the big 3 stumble and fall it's gonna hurt ALL of the auto industry BIG TIME and the rest will just be dominos.
11-29-2008, 06:33 PM
#7
Platinum Member
Join Date: 05-09-2006
Location: "Upland" Mesa, Arizona
Posts: 6,805
KEY EXECUTIVES PayExercisedMr. Vikram S. Pandit , 51
Chief Exec. Officer, Director and Member of Exec. Committee$ 250.00K$ 0Mr. Gary L. Crittenden , 54
Chief Financial Officer and Member of Operating Committee$ 14.43M$ 0Mr. Stephen R. Volk , 71
Vice Chairman and Member of Operating Committee$ 1.51M$ 0Mr. Lewis B. Kaden Esq., 65
Vice Chairman, Member of Bus. Heads Committee and Member of Operating Committee$ 4.50M$ 0William McNamee ,
PresN/A N/ADollar amounts are as of 31-Dec-07 and compensation values are for the last fiscal year ending on that date. "Pay" is salary, bonuses, etc. "Exercised" is the value of options exercised during the fiscal year.
11-29-2008, 07:08 PM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: 07-05-2008
Location: Akron Ohio
Posts: 5,464
Unless I missed something and Yahoo Financial has incorrect postings for CitiCorp...
KEY EXECUTIVES PayExercisedMr. Vikram S. Pandit , 51
Chief Exec. Officer, Director and Member of Exec. Committee$ 250.00K$ 0Mr. Gary L. Crittenden , 54
Chief Financial Officer and Member of Operating Committee$ 14.43M$ 0Mr. Stephen R. Volk , 71
Vice Chairman and Member of Operating Committee$ 1.51M$ 0Mr. Lewis B. Kaden Esq., 65
Vice Chairman, Member of Bus. Heads Committee and Member of Operating Committee$ 4.50M$ 0William McNamee ,
PresN/A N/ADollar amounts are as of 31-Dec-07 and compensation values are for the last fiscal year ending on that date. "Pay" is salary, bonuses, etc. "Exercised" is the value of options exercised during the fiscal year.
KEY EXECUTIVES PayExercisedMr. Vikram S. Pandit , 51
Chief Exec. Officer, Director and Member of Exec. Committee$ 250.00K$ 0Mr. Gary L. Crittenden , 54
Chief Financial Officer and Member of Operating Committee$ 14.43M$ 0Mr. Stephen R. Volk , 71
Vice Chairman and Member of Operating Committee$ 1.51M$ 0Mr. Lewis B. Kaden Esq., 65
Vice Chairman, Member of Bus. Heads Committee and Member of Operating Committee$ 4.50M$ 0William McNamee ,
PresN/A N/ADollar amounts are as of 31-Dec-07 and compensation values are for the last fiscal year ending on that date. "Pay" is salary, bonuses, etc. "Exercised" is the value of options exercised during the fiscal year.
No matter the number you should have a good underatanding the banks are getting loans with little hassel vs what the auto comapnies are being put through.
The banking industry does have more lobbiest you know. More bribes more easier loans. Nuf said.
11-29-2008, 07:15 PM
#9
Platinum Member
Join Date: 05-09-2006
Location: "Upland" Mesa, Arizona
Posts: 6,805
I don't disagree with your analysis. I just think you need not embellish (if you did) information to provide convincing arguement. The financial industry has enough TRUEisms that need correction....
12-01-2008, 01:26 AM
#10
Banned
Join Date: 08-25-2007
Location: Myrtle Beach SC
Posts: 488
If any of the Big Three go under now America would immediatly go into a full depression. Now I do not ike the idea of giving Government money to any business it is absolutly critical to our economy that they survive.
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
My business is stuggling and may not make it. A Government grant or loan would help me get it back in shape. I have had to cut costs, advertising and people. Good people, but there is no money coming in so we have to make hard decisions.
There is a huge difference here though. If my business goes under I lose a bunch of money. My employees and suppliers would lose out but this great country would go on. If GM goes under America goes into a full scale depression and the world as we know will never be the same. Atleast not in any of our lifetimes. Curly
If we dod lose 2% of the work force thats still far lsee then the 10% of the workforce unemployed in 1981.The days of the American auto industry holding up the economy are long gone. The only thing one needs to worry about is who will make the military vehicles. Some one will love to fill that gap.
We will not go into a full scale depression. Pockets of the country will suffer a depression. Toyota dealers here are doing BETTER than last year and hiring. People are choosing the imports instead of the domestics becasue they have no faith in the domestic auto companies and the UAW.
2% of the workforce is hardly depression era stuff. Besides, We have the FDIC which will avoid a run on the banks that really caused the Depression. The 10 magins in the stock market at that time meant if you were fully margined and your stock went down just 10% you were wiped out. If it went sown more you were deep in debt. There are a lot of factors that caused the Depression of 1929 and it was NATIONAL. The tipping point was the Smoot Hawley act Protectionism does not work.
The retailer I work part time for is doing the same numbers he did last year. Black Friday was HIGHER than last year and there were more cash buyers.
This gloom and doom is misplaced. The UAW and Management screwed the pooch. Period. Yeah we are bailng out banks BUT WE HAVE AN EQUITY POSITION in an area of business that has ALWAYS recovered,
Studebaker is gone forever. Oldsmobile is gone forever, The auto companies will not recover if they do business as usual and don't get rid of those who caused them to be in this position which is benefiting Toyota and Honda bigtime. Show me a business pan that will work. Shoe me how you are going to get Americans to buy American, Those who aren't hurting will stay away from the American cars. Those who are cannot afford them.
As far as the big bank bailouts go people will always need money, and loans, and invest. 500 banks have failed. That leaves those who toll them over stronger and more likely to reap rewards for the Governments investment.
You guys preaching doom and gloom re the Auto industry on a national basis are actually serving to prevent people from buying American. I sold my wife's Mitsubishi jsut befpre the local Mitsubishi dealer closed its doors. Saw the woring on the wal there. The Lancer kept them alive for awhile.