Maintenance and Upkeep Discussion HHR maintenance tips ranging from oil change intervals to brake pads and everything in between.

New Struts: Brake Judder, Camber, Height

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 08-10-2013 | 01:31 PM
  #1  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
New Struts: Brake Judder, Camber, Height

I have performed another experiment the results may tie a few things together.

I just replaced the struts on my 2011 LT, so only 5 miles involved so far.

Only thing done was replace the OE factory struts with Monroe QuikStruts with the asterisk. There is a warning label on the springs about them settling over time.

Observations:

1) the car sits noticeably higher in the front, I did not measure before/after, but it looks like a good 2 inches higher.

2) The camber is indeed notably negative now (outside of the tires in contact with the road more). Like this \ /

3) the brake judder seems to be gone. But only a few miles around the neighborhood.


Lessons to be taken:

A) Don't get an alignment immediately after changing the struts, wait for the new springs to settle in. It should not need it anyway.

B) Maybe brake judder fix, there was still a tiny bit.
Old 08-10-2013 | 03:08 PM
  #2  
firemangeorge's Avatar
Platinum Member
 
Joined: 12-06-2009
Posts: 11,431
From: Alabama
Interesting read donbrew.
So what is the ride height now? I figure you will measure it now, let them settle, then measure again.
2 inches is a huge increase in ride height but I believe it if you say it's so. And yes, 2 inches would definitely have an effect on the camber.(got an angle reader laying around? Throw it up on the fronts and it would give you ballpark estimate at how much the camber is off)
Front camber specs= -0.95 degrees,,+ or - 0.75 degrees. Not much room for a "visible" camber lean.
Old 08-10-2013 | 05:03 PM
  #3  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
After driving around a few miles a sitting for a few hours. The camber is not as noticeable, sorry no gauge. But still high in the front, the car is about level instead of the rear sitting high. And I can't even see the hood while driving.

I also noted that the distance between the lower spring support and my 215-55X16 stock tires is about an inch. I never actually looked before on this car, but on the 2008 with 215-60X16 the gap was very small.

And also don't seem to have a "tick" sound when I put it in gear anymore, but that's only 5-6 tries.

My stopping distance has improved markedly, so I guess I was right to go ahead and change them out at 98,000 miles. It was raining when I tested. Next weeks 1500 miles will give me a better idea.
Old 08-11-2013 | 04:59 PM
  #4  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
I have driven another 10 miles. Judder is reduced, but still there. The car no longer has that "nose dive" look. Measured the height center of wheel to bottom of fender well 215-55X16 tires (got about 10,000 miles left) 27.5 inches.

Next brake job includes rotors and hubs.

I looked at the LCA bushings, they are the solid ones and one of the bolts looks like it has had an impact wrench applied to it, I have a new set in stock anyway.
Old 08-11-2013 | 05:05 PM
  #5  
IgottaWoody's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Joined: 01-13-2008
Posts: 4,708
From: Washington State, where it rains
you say it sets really high...also that there is a big gap between tire and strut....Id be doing some measurements betweenn the new and old struts...sounds to me like they arnt the right ones....should only have around a quarter inch gap...
Old 08-11-2013 | 05:26 PM
  #6  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
The gap is not something I'm worried about, different tires different cars never measured before etc. and I am expecting the springs to settle as the label states. It sure does feel different! You don't know they are bad until you replace them.
Old 08-11-2013 | 08:55 PM
  #7  
SS fan's Avatar
Premium Member
 
Joined: 10-09-2010
Posts: 14,420
From: Tacoma
Well that would give you room to run some off road tires for winter. I have changed the struts on a few of these truckletts and never had a change in perch height, I think Woody is on to something, you wont need before measurement just grab the old strut and measure it. I bet the new ones at 3/4" shorter. Might want to check, wouldn't be the first time someone stuffed the wrong thing in a box.
Old 08-12-2013 | 09:56 AM
  #8  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
I didn't mean to say the perch height was different, just that I noticed a difference between this car and the old car. The springs seem to be settling a bit. My front end sway that I never noticed until I put new rear shocks on is gone.
Old 08-16-2013 | 05:22 PM
  #9  
donbrew's Avatar
Thread Starter
Moderator
 
Joined: 01-23-2009
Posts: 25,339
From: Fredericksburg,VA
After 1000 miles and carrying 400 lb around for the last 100 miles. The front measurement is still 27.5 inches, the brakes still judder, the car appears to sit more level than it used to (less of a nose dive stance), camber is not noticeable anymore (that may have been an artifact from lowering off of the jackstands). But it sure does brake and handle better still.

It also drives like the front end is higher. When I kick it to change lanes in traffic, it feels like a turbo for tiny bit of time (the handling part, anyway), until the power gets into the equation.

Last edited by donbrew; 08-16-2013 at 09:12 PM.
Old 08-16-2013 | 09:35 PM
  #10  
oldracer's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Joined: 04-01-2013
Posts: 182
From: Chula Vista CA
The camber you described is "positive" camber and not negative. On our HHRs that would equate to having some toe-out which results is twitchy steering which is what you are feeling. I would suggest getting a pair of spring clamps and pull one or two of the coils together and get the front end back to where is was.

You can measure the camber with a large steel carpenter's square. With the car on a level spot, put the square against the wheel/tire and measure the distance between the edge of the square and the lower rim. Then measure the distance between the edge of the square and the upper rim and if they are the same there in NO camber. If the top has a larger reading than the bottom then there is negative camber (okay in moderation) and if it is smaller then you have positive which is generally always bad. Below is a link to an article I wrote many years ago for making a toe in/out tool and how to check camber and toe. Note the wheel diameter is 15 inches which is what we have on those old vintage race cars but you can get the idea.

http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...ome_toe_in.htm


Quick Reply: New Struts: Brake Judder, Camber, Height



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:34 PM.